Supercharged 4 or stock 6?
- Thread starter vavs
- Start date
Tug-n-pull
New member
1045555
Why do you feel the need for the change either way? What are you useing your jeep for? Tug[addsig]
Why do you feel the need for the change either way? What are you useing your jeep for? Tug[addsig]
RAVEN13xxx
New member
1045558
www.avengersuperchargers.com has blowers for the 2.5 and the 4.0 for around $4,000. For the money, I would rather do a V-8 conversion for around $3,000 including motor.[addsig]
www.avengersuperchargers.com has blowers for the 2.5 and the 4.0 for around $4,000. For the money, I would rather do a V-8 conversion for around $3,000 including motor.[addsig]
1045563
<TABLE BORDER=0 ALIGN=CENTER WIDTH=85%><TR><TD><font class="pn-sub">Quote:</font><HR></TD></TR><TR><TD><FONT class="pn-sub"><BLOCKQUOTE>http://www.avengersuperchargers.com has blowers for the 2.5 and the 4.0 for around $4,000. For the money, I would rather do a V-8 conversion for around $3,000 including motor.</BLOCKQUOTE></FONT></TD></TR><TR><TD><HR></TD></TR></TABLE>
raven, i dunno where you can do a v8 swap for around $3,000 MAYBE seperate from what you spend on the engine, but hell if you know where to do it for $3,000 then im damn pissed because mine just ended up around $4,800 ... which i might add is still a hell of a lot better idea then supercharging the 4 banger...what a waist of 4,000 and as far as swapping in a 4.0, although it might be cheaper only by the fact that you dont have to spend money at Advanced adapters, but 4.0L jeeps are common, much better idea to go with a 350 if you've got the money in the first place[addsig]
<TABLE BORDER=0 ALIGN=CENTER WIDTH=85%><TR><TD><font class="pn-sub">Quote:</font><HR></TD></TR><TR><TD><FONT class="pn-sub"><BLOCKQUOTE>http://www.avengersuperchargers.com has blowers for the 2.5 and the 4.0 for around $4,000. For the money, I would rather do a V-8 conversion for around $3,000 including motor.</BLOCKQUOTE></FONT></TD></TR><TR><TD><HR></TD></TR></TABLE>
raven, i dunno where you can do a v8 swap for around $3,000 MAYBE seperate from what you spend on the engine, but hell if you know where to do it for $3,000 then im damn pissed because mine just ended up around $4,800 ... which i might add is still a hell of a lot better idea then supercharging the 4 banger...what a waist of 4,000 and as far as swapping in a 4.0, although it might be cheaper only by the fact that you dont have to spend money at Advanced adapters, but 4.0L jeeps are common, much better idea to go with a 350 if you've got the money in the first place[addsig]
RAVEN13xxx
New member
1045566
Exactly my point. I've done several V-8 converts for customers. The $3,000 was cost, not retail. Sorry. Retail was about 4,500-5,500 depending on the motor. Dropped a LT-1 vette motor in a guys 99 TJ for $8,000 including the OBD II ECM. I'm going to do my 97 soon. Just rebuilding the 350 TPI now. [addsig]
Exactly my point. I've done several V-8 converts for customers. The $3,000 was cost, not retail. Sorry. Retail was about 4,500-5,500 depending on the motor. Dropped a LT-1 vette motor in a guys 99 TJ for $8,000 including the OBD II ECM. I'm going to do my 97 soon. Just rebuilding the 350 TPI now. [addsig]
1045579
I was intersted in keeping my 4 because I just spent about 3000 on the 4 cyclinder that is in my Jeep now. You are probably going to call me dumb, but I didn't have a choice. The money to buy the Jeep was loaned to me by my parents and they said I couldn't modify it until it was paid for. How much do you have to do to a engine to hold up to the extra power? Thanks for the help.
vavs[addsig]
I was intersted in keeping my 4 because I just spent about 3000 on the 4 cyclinder that is in my Jeep now. You are probably going to call me dumb, but I didn't have a choice. The money to buy the Jeep was loaned to me by my parents and they said I couldn't modify it until it was paid for. How much do you have to do to a engine to hold up to the extra power? Thanks for the help.
vavs[addsig]
jeeperwilly
New member
1045581
Start with a K & N, maybe a cold air inductions. Look and see what you can find out on the market. There are plenty of small cheap things that can add up the horsepower and torque to an engine.
[addsig]
Start with a K & N, maybe a cold air inductions. Look and see what you can find out on the market. There are plenty of small cheap things that can add up the horsepower and torque to an engine.
Bounty__Hunter
Super Moderator
1045585
Supercharge the 4banger, much more fun to drive a powerful light Jeep, and much more rare than any old conversion. Dare to be different, you'll enjoy it. I enjoy my 4banger with a few power mods, can't imagine how much fun it would be to be blown
[addsig]
Supercharge the 4banger, much more fun to drive a powerful light Jeep, and much more rare than any old conversion. Dare to be different, you'll enjoy it. I enjoy my 4banger with a few power mods, can't imagine how much fun it would be to be blown
jeepwanabe
New member
1045597
<TABLE BORDER=0 ALIGN=CENTER WIDTH=85%><TR><TD><font class="pn-sub">Quote:</font><HR></TD></TR><TR><TD><FONT class="pn-sub"><BLOCKQUOTE> Retail was about 4,500-5,500 depending on the motor </BLOCKQUOTE></FONT></TD></TR><TR><TD><HR></TD></TR></TABLE>
Raven13xxx,
How come so much? Can you give me more details? Are these used engines or crate engines or what? I priced out a 4.0L out of a 97 Grand Cherokee with 60k out of a salvage yard for 1150.00 with MPFI, harness, computer, everything and I contacted a shop who said they'd put it in for me for between 600.00 to 800.00 if I brought them the engine. Then I heard I'd need a bellhousing adapter for about $336.00 which brings the total cost to around 2400.00 with my math. Please let me know if I'm missing some unseen costs. I have an 83 CJ7 I6 258/Carb T5 stock transmission. Also, what state are you in.
Thanks,
Bill[addsig]
<TABLE BORDER=0 ALIGN=CENTER WIDTH=85%><TR><TD><font class="pn-sub">Quote:</font><HR></TD></TR><TR><TD><FONT class="pn-sub"><BLOCKQUOTE> Retail was about 4,500-5,500 depending on the motor </BLOCKQUOTE></FONT></TD></TR><TR><TD><HR></TD></TR></TABLE>
Raven13xxx,
How come so much? Can you give me more details? Are these used engines or crate engines or what? I priced out a 4.0L out of a 97 Grand Cherokee with 60k out of a salvage yard for 1150.00 with MPFI, harness, computer, everything and I contacted a shop who said they'd put it in for me for between 600.00 to 800.00 if I brought them the engine. Then I heard I'd need a bellhousing adapter for about $336.00 which brings the total cost to around 2400.00 with my math. Please let me know if I'm missing some unseen costs. I have an 83 CJ7 I6 258/Carb T5 stock transmission. Also, what state are you in.
Thanks,
Bill[addsig]
Bounty__Hunter
Super Moderator
1045599
<TABLE BORDER=0 ALIGN=CENTER WIDTH=85%><TR><TD><font class="pn-sub">Quote:</font><HR></TD></TR><TR><TD><FONT class="pn-sub"><BLOCKQUOTE>Out of curiosity...how much heavier is the 6 than the 4cyl?
</BLOCKQUOTE></FONT></TD></TR><TR><TD><HR></TD></TR></TABLE>
Good question, know how do we find out
I'd be interested in finding out how much difference there is, I think it's substantial.[addsig]
<TABLE BORDER=0 ALIGN=CENTER WIDTH=85%><TR><TD><font class="pn-sub">Quote:</font><HR></TD></TR><TR><TD><FONT class="pn-sub"><BLOCKQUOTE>Out of curiosity...how much heavier is the 6 than the 4cyl?
Good question, know how do we find out
1045604
These are the specs from a 97 TJ. Might help give us an idea.
Base Curb Weight, lbs
with 2.5L engine 3073
with 4.0L engine 3210
http://www.rendelldesigns.com/jeep/specs.html[addsig]
These are the specs from a 97 TJ. Might help give us an idea.
Base Curb Weight, lbs
with 2.5L engine 3073
with 4.0L engine 3210
http://www.rendelldesigns.com/jeep/specs.html[addsig]
RAVEN13xxx
New member
1045606
Bill, Some of the motors are crate motors (V-8's such as 5.0 Fords and 5.7 TPI or TBI chevy's to good ole carbed 350's, direct from dealer), but most are rebuilt Jasper motors. If the customer is changing from a 4 banger, we also change the trans (to at least an AX-15), and the input shaft to the t-case w/ SYE. We have found that, with some customers with lead feet, the D35 rear end doesn't hold up well, so we change it out also to a D44. Most of the parts we use are used, but thoughly inspected, rebuilt, or new (depending on the customer and their wants and needs). Also you have to look at welding in new motor mounts, at least a 3 row radiator, and misc brackets and such. We have also done several 4.0 conversions that range from $2,500-$4,000, again depending on what the customer wants. There's a lot more to think of than JUST a motor.[addsig]
Bill, Some of the motors are crate motors (V-8's such as 5.0 Fords and 5.7 TPI or TBI chevy's to good ole carbed 350's, direct from dealer), but most are rebuilt Jasper motors. If the customer is changing from a 4 banger, we also change the trans (to at least an AX-15), and the input shaft to the t-case w/ SYE. We have found that, with some customers with lead feet, the D35 rear end doesn't hold up well, so we change it out also to a D44. Most of the parts we use are used, but thoughly inspected, rebuilt, or new (depending on the customer and their wants and needs). Also you have to look at welding in new motor mounts, at least a 3 row radiator, and misc brackets and such. We have also done several 4.0 conversions that range from $2,500-$4,000, again depending on what the customer wants. There's a lot more to think of than JUST a motor.[addsig]
jeepwanabe
New member
1045616
Raven,
I currently have a I6 258/Carb w/T5 stock transmission. I want to upgrade to a 4.0 as I mentioned earlier. Can you offer any insights what I might be getting into to get this done?
For instance, the bell housing adapter I mentioned earlier for 336.00.
Will I need to add moter mounts?
What's a 3 row radiator?
Will I be able to use the wiring harness from the GC or will I need to buy new?
Have you seen this article? http://www.4x4wire.com/jeep/tech/engine/fi40swap01/
Do you think it's inline with what I want to do? Are there major gaps in this installation?
A lot of questions. Thanks for any information, insights, and help in this matter.[addsig]
Raven,
I currently have a I6 258/Carb w/T5 stock transmission. I want to upgrade to a 4.0 as I mentioned earlier. Can you offer any insights what I might be getting into to get this done?
For instance, the bell housing adapter I mentioned earlier for 336.00.
Will I need to add moter mounts?
What's a 3 row radiator?
Will I be able to use the wiring harness from the GC or will I need to buy new?
Have you seen this article? http://www.4x4wire.com/jeep/tech/engine/fi40swap01/
Do you think it's inline with what I want to do? Are there major gaps in this installation?
A lot of questions. Thanks for any information, insights, and help in this matter.[addsig]
1045639
Jonzey 4x4 - thanks for the specs. If mah teach learned me right back in the ol' days, that only makes a diff. of 137lbs. Even if all that weight is attributed to the engine size difference, that still is not much of a difference. I'm no engineer, my degree is in psychology (so I can make myself feel better when I screw up my Jeep, I should go for psychiatry so I can self medicate with something stronger than a Natural Light) but I would think that the weight /power ratio would balance out the weight difference. That difference is not much more than a full tank of gas, a winch, hi-jack, a Samuri on your bumper, etc... If anyone has any solid stats on weight vs. performance on the 4 vs. 6 or 8 or any other multiples of 2, please let us know...I welcome the input and gained knowledge.
[addsig]
Jonzey 4x4 - thanks for the specs. If mah teach learned me right back in the ol' days, that only makes a diff. of 137lbs. Even if all that weight is attributed to the engine size difference, that still is not much of a difference. I'm no engineer, my degree is in psychology (so I can make myself feel better when I screw up my Jeep, I should go for psychiatry so I can self medicate with something stronger than a Natural Light) but I would think that the weight /power ratio would balance out the weight difference. That difference is not much more than a full tank of gas, a winch, hi-jack, a Samuri on your bumper, etc... If anyone has any solid stats on weight vs. performance on the 4 vs. 6 or 8 or any other multiples of 2, please let us know...I welcome the input and gained knowledge.
MudderChuck
New member
1045661
Call Paxton in California, they are usually good at no BS assesments and have been in business forever. Ask to speak with an engineer (ask for Mr. Granatelli-the brother of) I´m sure they´ve done this and can inform you of the pitfalls. My experience tells me a bigger TBI, a engine oil cooler and radiator are the minimum add on´s besides the supercharger. I´ve done three, but they were all V-8s. An inter-cooler might also be required, along with an oiler kit for the blower and maybe a spark retarder. Ought to be a right zippy motor. Just to voice an oppinion, it´s usually heat and RPM´s that damage a motor. If you where to keep it under 4000 RPM´s and don´t let it overheat, the motor should last for a good long time.
They say it requires at least five cylinders to have overlapping drive strokes, the more cylinders the more overlapp (torque). But four bangers sure do rev quick. on a lighter vehicle they are right fast.[addsig]
Call Paxton in California, they are usually good at no BS assesments and have been in business forever. Ask to speak with an engineer (ask for Mr. Granatelli-the brother of) I´m sure they´ve done this and can inform you of the pitfalls. My experience tells me a bigger TBI, a engine oil cooler and radiator are the minimum add on´s besides the supercharger. I´ve done three, but they were all V-8s. An inter-cooler might also be required, along with an oiler kit for the blower and maybe a spark retarder. Ought to be a right zippy motor. Just to voice an oppinion, it´s usually heat and RPM´s that damage a motor. If you where to keep it under 4000 RPM´s and don´t let it overheat, the motor should last for a good long time.
They say it requires at least five cylinders to have overlapping drive strokes, the more cylinders the more overlapp (torque). But four bangers sure do rev quick. on a lighter vehicle they are right fast.[addsig]
RAVEN13xxx
New member
1045663
Bill, Your T-5 will be ok with the adapter. The motor mounts are a little different (you may want to double check me on that one). It's been a while since we did a 4.0 convert, since the rage now is V-8's. A 3 row radiator is basically a heavy duty one. Since you are switching from a 6 to a 6 the radiator won't be a problem. The wiring harness, I believe, should also be ok. We get most of ours from painless wiring. I was going to do the same with mine (4.0 convert), but got a great deal on a 350 TPI (wiring harness and ECM too) from my friends Z-28 that he wrecked. I also found a good used 4.0 w/ 50k on it for $800 from a local boneyard.[addsig]
Bill, Your T-5 will be ok with the adapter. The motor mounts are a little different (you may want to double check me on that one). It's been a while since we did a 4.0 convert, since the rage now is V-8's. A 3 row radiator is basically a heavy duty one. Since you are switching from a 6 to a 6 the radiator won't be a problem. The wiring harness, I believe, should also be ok. We get most of ours from painless wiring. I was going to do the same with mine (4.0 convert), but got a great deal on a 350 TPI (wiring harness and ECM too) from my friends Z-28 that he wrecked. I also found a good used 4.0 w/ 50k on it for $800 from a local boneyard.[addsig]
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